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D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS

Does anybody use the above combination? I'm having a serious swap-file
problem when I run Delphi 3 Pro (other apps work fine). The swap-file grows
to 73 MB and compiling simple programs takes forever (all I hear is
disc-scatching). I even get messages from Windows saying I'm running low on
virtual memory. My settings are the following :

-Paging file size for selected drive-
Drive : C:
Space avail. : 727 MB
Initial size : 43 MB
Max size : 200 MB

-Total paging file size for all drives-
min allowed : 2 MB
Recommended : 43 MB
Currently allocated : 43 MB

(The recommended size is RAM + 11 MB.)

I'm using a P133 w/ 32 MB of EDO RAM.

Does anybody know of a solution? The same machine was running D3 Pro &
Win95 without a problem.

Thank you

Alain Quesnel

If you reply by e-mail, remove the brackets on each side of my address.

 

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Alain -

Quote
>Does anybody use the above combination? I'm having a serious swap-file
>problem when I run Delphi 3 Pro (other apps work fine). The swap-file grows
>to 73 MB and compiling simple programs takes forever (all I hear is
>disc-scatching). I even get messages from Windows saying I'm running low on
>virtual memory.

I am running Delphi 3 C/S on a P133 with NT4.0 and 64Meg.  I haven't seen
anything like you are describing.

--
Clayton Neff
Software Project Leader
The Personal Marketing Company, Inc.
11843 West 83rd Terrace
Lenexa, KS  66214
(913)492-0322
clay...@tpmco.com

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote
Alain Quesnel wrote:

> Does anybody use the above combination? I'm having a serious swap-file
> problem when I run Delphi 3 Pro (other apps work fine). The swap-file grows
> to 73 MB and compiling simple programs takes forever (all I hear is
> disc-scatching). I even get messages from Windows saying I'm running low on
> virtual memory. My settings are the following :

> -Paging file size for selected drive-
> Drive : C:
> Space avail. : 727 MB
> Initial size : 43 MB
> Max size : 200 MB

> -Total paging file size for all drives-
> min allowed : 2 MB
> Recommended : 43 MB
> Currently allocated : 43 MB

> (The recommended size is RAM + 11 MB.)

> I'm using a P133 w/ 32 MB of EDO RAM.

Forget the recommended. That's garbage.

I have the same setup (P133 w/ 32MB EDO RAM) on one machine, although
it's running NT Server 4.0 as a workstation (i.e. no server software
running, no clients accessing the server, no web server, etc.). It's
just workstation stuff.

The swap file is on its own NTFS partition, nothing else is on the
partition, and its set at:

-Paging file size for selected drive-
Space avail. : 256 MB
Initial size : 80 MB
Max size : 160 MB

-Total paging file size for all drives-
min allowed : 2 MB
Recommended : 43 MB
Currently allocated : 80 MB

So, set your swap file size up to 60-80 MB. You've already given it
permission to go to 200 MB.

I do have a P133 w/ 64 MB EDO RAM running Windows NT Workstation 4.0.

It's set at:

-Paging file size for selected drive-
Space avail. : 256 MB
Initial size : 43 MB
Max size : 93 MB

-Total paging file size for all drives-
min allowed : 2 MB
Recommended : 75 MB
Currently allocated : 43 MB

It's set at 43 MB because the machine originally had 32 MB when NT was
installed. I never looked at the setting after installing more RAM.
Didn't need to. Huh? Maybe I should set it higher. Ehh, we'll see. Don't
really need to with 64 MB. But, never know, maybe I should.

Boolean

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


    I have not had any trouble running D3 Pro on my NT Workstation.  I
am using a 586/133 Overdrive w/ 24MB of RAM and a 35MB page file.  At
normal load all of my services are using about 22MB before I even start
Delphi.  It does not get very slow and it never locks up.  Sorry to hear
that you have trouble.

                                                                  Brian
Hoover <hoove...@cs.purdue.edu>

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


    I have not had any trouble running D3 Pro on my NT Workstation.  I
am using a 586/133 Overdrive w/ 24MB of RAM and a 35MB page file.  At
normal load all of my services are using about 22MB before I even start
Delphi.  It does not get very slow and it never locks up.  Sorry to hear
that you have trouble.

                                                                  Brian
Hoover <hoove...@cs.purdue.edu>

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote
Fernand Raynaud wrote:

<snip>
> I typically set the swap
> file (preferably on a not too fragmented drive) to a little under 100 MB to
> start, with a max of whatever you can muster, e.g. 250 MB. If NT has to
> work to expand the swap space, and if your disk is fragmented, it can be
> very slow.

That's exactly why I place the swap file on its own partition. I even go
a step further, I place the cache folders for my web browser on its own
partition. A little 40-50 MB partition is fine. Web browser caching
causes a tremendous amount of fragmentation.

You wanna know a trick you can do with NT if you're using the Server
version.

Make a mirror of the partition that you use for your web browser cache.
In effect, you've doubled the bandwidth at which you can read and write
to your cache. I've noticed significant speed increases by using this
technique. It even works extremely well on T1 lines. The higher the
bandwidth, the faster your cache needs to work.

It's also a wise idea to do the same by mirroring your swap file
partition. The swap file, in effect, has twice the available bandwidth.

But there's one caveat, it requires two hard drives. That's the way
mirroring works. But, it's really best if you can to have more than one
hard drive in your computer anyway.

Quote
> All of these apps also leak memory like crazy, and aborted or crashed runs
> don't help, so it just gets worse over time.

I work extremely hard at making sure there's no resource and memory
leaks in my programs. But I've seen other programs have a tremendous
amount of resource and memory leaks. It's a fact, there are programs out
there with enormous leaks. I make sure mine is not one of them.

Quote
>  NT doesn't crash very often,

Well, I've frozen NT on pointer errors before. It can happen. You never
know when the smallest pointer error goes amuck in the system. You've
gotta act fast to get those worked out. It's not fun at all trying to
debug a program when the machine just freezes -- no Task Manager and
mouse either. But little mistakes like that can bite at unsuspecting
times. I've gotten really good at tracking down pointer and memory
errors. Enough experience will show you what pointer and memory errors
are like, and what's the likely cause in your program.

Quote
> but you need to at least log out now and then to try to reclaim SOME
> memory. I've taken to rebooting my Server-as-workstation machine every few
> days just to reclaim the rest of the memory.

Same here.

Quote
> So check your disk for fragmentation, just so you know.  Frankly I'm not
> sure if you can use the win95 defrag program on an NT FAT partition,

I think you can use a DOS defrag without any problems on a NT FAT
partition.

Boolean

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote

> I think you can use a DOS defrag without any problems on a NT FAT
> partition.

*Don't* do this.

You may TRASH your profiles / desktop settings. DEFRAG will rewrite files
as 8.3 names

Anyway the MS / Symantec DEFRAG is hopeless on large drives as it can't
cache the directory/file structure in memory and bombs.

Cheers

patrick

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote
Boolean <defaultu...@domain.com> wrote:
>Patrick wrote:

>> > I think you can use a DOS defrag without any problems on a NT FAT
>> > partition.

>> *Don't* do this.

>> You may TRASH your profiles / desktop settings. DEFRAG will rewrite files
>> as 8.3 names

>You're right!!! I never tried it before. But yeah, it would change all
>the files to 8.3 filenames.

The Win 95 defragger is and always has been long-file-name aware.  It
doesn't run under NT because of direct disk access restrictions, but you
can dual boot W95 and defrag your NT FAT partitions with impunity.

- Tim Roberts, t...@probo.com
  Providenza & Boekelheide, Inc

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote
Boolean wrote:
> But that's a bloatware of a defragger. Wouldn't you agree? :-)

There is a defragger for NT and NTFS called DiskKeeper.  You can
download a free (Lite) copy for you can get a full evaluation version.
                                                        Brian Hoover
<hoove...@cs.purdue.edu>

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote
Brian Hoover wrote:

> > But that's a bloatware of a defragger. Wouldn't you agree? :-)

> There is a defragger for NT and NTFS called DiskKeeper.  You can
> download a free (Lite) copy for you can get a full evaluation version.

I've heard of this tool. I believe one network that I managed at one
point is now running it.

Do you have a link to their site? I can probably find it though.

Have you tried it yet?

Boolean

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote
>Alain Quesnel wrote:
>> I'm using a P133 w/ 32 MB of EDO RAM.

I'm usually on machines with atleast twice as much RAM, but a while
back I did use a Compaq (yueck!) P5-166 w/32MB and it did perform
just fine. (didn't notice too much difference after doubling memory,
although I probably wouldn't be too happy if I had to downgrade again :-) )

What other apps do you run?

What does Task Manager tell you? (try and watch the pagefault delta column
and see if it's really Delphi doing all the swapping)

Be aware that if you open up e.g. the Win32 API help and activate full
text search, Winhlp32 will consume quite a lot of memory... (it seems
like such an innocent task, but yet...)

In article <33FB82C9.23409...@domain.com>,

Quote
Boolean <defaultu...@domain.com> wrote:

>Forget the recommended. That's garbage.

No, it's not.

AFAIK, NT needs to be able to page out all your RAM to disk, so if you
have 1GB RAM you end up with a 1GB+11MB pagefile... (atleast that was
the consensus last time I checked up comp.os.ms-windows.nt.*)

And it's not too good a idea to have more pagefile than that either. If
you really need more memory, buy some RAM chips, not disk.

--
=\
 *=- R.Moberg, atleast it's stable, right?
=/

Re:D3 Pro & Windows NT 4.0 WS


Quote
Chris Hill wrote:

> http://www.execsoft.com

> I purchased the workstation version and run it daily.  The workstation
> version can be run as a service, so I have it run at 3AM every night.
> In case I am still up at that hour, I also have it set to run at idle
> priority.  It seems to work well.

> The demo can defrag your NTFS (or FAT) drive, the only restriction is
> that it must be invoked manually.

I'm on their site right now. They mention on the main page that the
manual version of their Diskeeper will be included in Windows NT 5.0.
Cool!!! Maybe there's reason to upgrade to NT 5.0 yet.

Boolean

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