Board index » delphi » Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?


2006-01-04 08:14:00 PM
delphi186
Pete Goodwin writes:
Quote
The new form designer alignment stuff - annoying. I switched it off
once I descovered it refused to allow me to align something the way I
wanted it.
Ever tried the CTRL+Cusrors or SHIFT+Cursors or ALT+MouseMove ?
Quote
The 'for' template works but assumes I want:

"for i := 0 to n - 1 do"

but sometimes I don't want that, then it gets in the way.
The only other way to use for is the "downto" or "in" for loop. And for
this there are the "forin" and "forr" templates. They are not autoinvoked
but that could be easily changed.
--
Regards,
Andreas Hausladen
 
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Pete Goodwin writes:
Quote
If I hit F1 on midiOpenStream, and it says "topic not found", but works
fine in D7,
Maybe because it is called "midiStreamOpen" first the "Stream" then the
"Open". And my Delphi 2006 Help finds the topic for midiStreamOpen if I
press F1 on the word "midiStreamOpen".
--
Regards,
Andreas Hausladen
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

My impressions:
Short:
Delphi 7 - Delphi 2005, no
Delphi 7 - Delphi 2005, yes
Long:
I am an engineer-programmer, not a programmer-programmer, so some
of the fine points on IDE features and code details are beyond me -
if something works for me, good, else work-around or move on
(practicality).
That being said, I am also totally loyal to Borland and will
continue to do so in the future. I have used every compiler product
they have produced since Pascal. [Just so you know my bias :) ]
Delphi 7 should go down in the history books as a 'golden moment'
product in information science - I start it up and the copyright
shows 2002! Four years is an eternity in sw time units...
Bottom line for me - Delphi 7 produced so many successful projects that
it will continue to occupy space on my hard drive.
Delphi 2005 with all its problems produced some successful projects
(Win32 and DotNet.), but with most of the head aches described
elsewhere. It will be un-installed in the next few months.
Delphi 2006 has been a winner from the moment of installation.
Subjective performance improvements, and yes, even IDE features I
have started to use (refactoring - who knew!). In my customer base the
main demand is still for Win32, but DotNet is there as well...
Best Regards to all
Pete Goodwin writes:
Quote
These are my impressions after using Delphi 2006 Professional for a
couple of weeks...

To Delphi 2005, no. Delphi 2005 is an unfinished product, even after 3
updates.

To Delphi 2006...

For Win32 products, I would have to say no. I think you might as well stay
with Delphi 7.
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Oops - too much coffee this morning - second impression should read
Delphi 7 - Delphi 2006, yes
Rudy Poseika writes:
Quote
My impressions:
Short:
Delphi 7 - Delphi 2005, no
Delphi 7 - Delphi 2005, yes
Long:
I am an engineer-programmer, not a programmer-programmer, so some
of the fine points on IDE features and code details are beyond me -
if something works for me, good, else work-around or move on
(practicality).
That being said, I am also totally loyal to Borland and will
continue to do so in the future. I have used every compiler product
they have produced since Pascal. [Just so you know my bias :) ]
Delphi 7 should go down in the history books as a 'golden moment'
product in information science - I start it up and the copyright
shows 2002! Four years is an eternity in sw time units...

Bottom line for me - Delphi 7 produced so many successful projects that
it will continue to occupy space on my hard drive.

Delphi 2005 with all its problems produced some successful projects
(Win32 and DotNet.), but with most of the head aches described
elsewhere. It will be un-installed in the next few months.

Delphi 2006 has been a winner from the moment of installation.
Subjective performance improvements, and yes, even IDE features I
have started to use (refactoring - who knew!). In my customer base the
main demand is still for Win32, but DotNet is there as well...

Best Regards to all

Pete Goodwin writes:

>These are my impressions after using Delphi 2006 Professional for a
>couple of weeks...
>
>To Delphi 2005, no. Delphi 2005 is an unfinished product, even after 3
>updates.
>
>To Delphi 2006...
>
>For Win32 products, I would have to say no. I think you might as well stay
>with Delphi 7.
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Pete Goodwin <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<43bbc63a$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
inlining - can not say I have noticed this. But then I haven't been looking
for it!

for ... in - not noticed this one.
Maybe you should actually notice the features of D2006 before you discuss
D2006. Eh?
--
***Free Your Mind***
Posted with JSNewsreader Preview 1.0.4.1893
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Pete Goodwin <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<43bbc74c$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
I think not.
Well, it sure doesn't qualify as "fact". that is for sure. You yourself said you
were just expressing your opinion.
My feeling is that you are not providing useful information for others with
these posts of yours about D2006 but instead are just spreading uninformed FUD.
--
***Free Your Mind***
Posted with JSNewsreader Preview 1.0.4.1893
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Pete Goodwin <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<43bbc786$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
for i := 1 to n do

there's an example of how the template gets it wrong.
User error. The template never gets it wrong, since the user has total control
over templates.
This incessant whining of yours about things that are SO easy to fix or alter
is tiring. If it is so hard for you to adapt the D2006 IDE, of all IDE's, to do
exactly what you want, then I really have to wonder. Isn't it the job of a
software developer to find solutions to problems, to adapt software to the
users' needs? You seem highly resistant to what is actually a very simple
example of this type of activity.
--
***Free Your Mind***
Posted with JSNewsreader Preview 1.0.4.1893
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Pete Goodwin writes:
Quote
for i := 1 to n do

there's an example of how the template gets it wrong.
You can TAB through the points. And the -1 can be removed if you move the
caret out of the "List.Count" and moving it back. This is still faster
than typing the whole for statement by hand.
BTW: The only situation where I need a "1 to n" is when I access the chars
of a string. And for this the compiler generates faster code if you use
this:
for i := 0 to Length(S) - 1 do
S[i + 1] := ' ';
Because With S[i] the compiler generates "S[i - 1]". Using the "S[i + 1]"
the compiler is inteligent enough to evaluate the S[i- 1 + 1] to S[i],
making the addressing faster.
--
Regards,
Andreas Hausladen
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Quote
It's cost me ?600 to get a new version of Delphi with all these
features as I bought Delphi 2005 and 2006. So, I am somewhat annoyed!
Return it, get your money back, tell Borland of your grievences and move on.
Quote
--
Pete Goodwin
Cheesed off Kylix, C++ Builder V6 and Delphi 2005, 2006 owner
You can choose to be cheesed off....or stop buying Borland products.
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Quote
Is adding methods to records more important than updating the
positively prehistoric case syntax? I mean, how many languages still
allow only ordinal values in a case statement? At least add string
support to the case statement.
The case statement is that way because the compiler generates a jump table.
The jump table has to have known values, so it can only be ordinals. Creating
a case statement that supports anything would basically be the same as if
then else if then else, etc... A case statement on an ordinal is much more
efficient (only one comparison and jump) as opposed to a big ol' list of
if-thens... Perhaps the compiler could be made to translate non-ordinal
cases into more of an if-then type of code...
I really kinda like it the way it is though.
Ryan
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

"Pete Goodwin" wrote on 4 Jan 2006 00:59:29 -0700:
Quote
To Delphi 2005, no. Delphi 2005 is an unfinished product, even after 3
updates.
Let's all try to forget about Delphi 2005. Everyone has a bad day.
Quote
To Delphi 2006...

For Win32 products, I would have to say no. I think you might as well stay
with Delphi 7.
I just couldn't disagree more. D2006 is the ultimate Win32
development tool. When D2005 came out I was using both Delphi 7 and D2005
depending on the project. Once I got my hands on D2006, Delphi 7 was gone.
D2006 rocks!
Quote
The new form designer alignment stuff - annoying. I switched it off
once I descovered it refused to allow me to align something the way I
wanted it.
It takes a little getting used to, but if you work with it, it will
make your dialogs better formed. Microsoft spends millions of dollars
on UI research and I for one am glad that Borland is automating the
process of complying with their recommendations. At least, I think
that's what's happening. Microsoft's Vista UI guidelines seem to mesh
well with what Borland is doing now.
Quote
The new templates - useful, but not worth the effort. I frequently get
a couple of popups obscuring what I can see.
It's hit and miss here for me -- I haven't quite gotten used to it
yet, but I like it nonetheless.
Quote
The new help - what was the point? A new help that has topics missing,
is slower? I am using WIN32, why does it start showing me help for C#,
C++ and Delphi.NET?
Alas, I have found Delphi help to be somewhat lacking since D2005 as
well.
Quote
The IDE is better than Delphi 2005 but still sluggish compared to D7.
Well, it would only be sluggish if your system is too old to handle
it. It runs great for me. I have seen others say it is "just as fast"
as D7. I wouldn't know -- I upgraded my computer right before I
installed D2006 so I can not really compare. But it runs fine for me --
with one minor hiccup every once in a while that I can solve with a
re-start. Nothing's perfect.
Quote
What is happening at Borland? Delphi used to be a brilliant product.
Now it seems to be a bloated monster with bits dropping off.
IMO, D2006 is full redemption for what I perceived to be Borland's
problems since Delphi 8.
--
Brandon Staggs
www.swordsearcher.com
www.akamaisoftware.com
www.brandonstaggs.com
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

"John Jacobson" <jake@j[nospam]snewsreader.com>writes
Quote
This incessant whining of yours about things that are SO easy to fix or
alter
is tiring. If it is so hard for you to adapt the D2006 IDE, of all IDE's,
to do
exactly what you want, then I really have to wonder. Isn't it the job of a
software developer to find solutions to problems, to adapt software to the
users' needs? You seem highly resistant to what is actually a very simple
example of this type of activity.
Poorly worded. What I meant to say was that you ought to view templates as a
powerful feature that you can shape and bend to your will, not as a fixed
impediment to your productivity, and that I suggest taking a different
approach than you have heretofore embraced.
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Quote
For Win32 products, I would have to say no. I think you might as well stay
with Delphi 7.
You might think that, but that is obviously because you don't use (or find
use for) half features of D2006. If you feel that Delphi 7 is "as good" then I
must assume that:
1) You don't have a large project with multiple DLLs/BPLs
2) You don't have to debug a project with DLLs/BPLs
3) You don't use StarTeam and thus find no value in the StarTeam integration
4) You aren't interested in class diagraming and refactoring in Together
5) Don't care about all the cool new editor, IDE, and de{*word*81} enhancements
I recently had to debug a package based on a package based on a package.
In Delphi 7 I *might* be able to debug it with breakpoints once before it either
stops responding or stops breaking. In D2006, not only did it work EVERY
time without restarting, it worked faster than I have ever seen Delphi debug.
There are several things that are faster in D2006 than Delphi 7 (compile times,
opening project options, code completion, start up times w/ Win32 only).
I have yet to find ANYTHING that is slower on my machine and if it is, it
is so negligible that I have not noticed. Granted, I do not have 2000 components
installed, but I do have 500+ and notice no issues at all. It is also about
as stable as any product that I have seen.
So, yeah, if you don't want to be more productive and you think that Delphi 7 has
little room for improvement because you don't use any of the advanced features,
then ok, it is about the same... I however, cringe when I have to fire up
D7 to make a change to our current release's codebase. I'd NEVER go
back to it. Just my opinion.
Ryan
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Quote
Is adding methods to records more important than updating the
positively prehistoric case syntax? I mean, how many languages still
allow only ordinal values in a case statement? At least add string
support to the case statement.
IMO, YES, most definitely, record methods are worth much more than an improved
case statement. With record methods (and visiblity specifiers and properties)
you can make record handling much cleaner and readable. Of course you can
use objects instead but when you need to handle tons of small objects in
performance sensitive code static allocation of records could prove a major
advantage: no allocation-deallocation, improved memory locality.
As for the case statement: during several years of programming in Delphi
I did not find a situation where I felt the necessity of non-ordinal case
statements. IMO multiple ifs are not much less readable.
 

Re: Is it worth upgrading from Delphi 7 to Delphi 2005/2006?

Pete Goodwin writes:
Quote

What is happening at Borland? Delphi used to be a brilliant product.
Now it seems to be a bloated monster with bits dropping off.

For now, I am sticking with Delphi 7. I can add the Fastcode project bits
myself and get most of the IDE enhancements with GExperts and Castalia.
When and if .Net becomes the norm, I will finally make the upgrade. The
minor additional language features in Object Pascal are not enough to
make a case at this point.
Is adding methods to records more important than updating the positively
prehistoric case syntax? I mean, how many languages still allow only
ordinal values in a case statement? At least add string support to the
case statement.
My $0.02.
Mark