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Re: Say it ain't so Boz


2005-08-17 02:20:08 AM
delphi146
John Jacobson aka Captain Jake writes:
Quote
Maybe, but some people here would still interpret them in the most
pessimistic fashion possible.

Pessimistic? Non-Tech? No way!
 
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

Quote
At least the primary one. It is the spotlight product for the Develop
phase. Once you click the link, you see all of the IDE solutions,
including Delphi.
I laughed when you mentioned this the first time and I chuckled again this
time. It is much more likely that this is merely an artifact of how one
constructs a website to reuse webpages than an intentional design choice.
Honestly, as if "CodeWright" or "Kylix" is part of their ALM strategy. And
if "CodeWright" is indeed part of their ALM strategy, then "Delphi" is on
par in significance right? Not very comforting.
If they really thought that Delphi was an integral part of their ALM suite
and wanted to sell it that way, why not put it right below JBuilder on that
page? I know that if I actually believed that, I'd find a way to tell
the Java story *and* the dotNET story in one page.
Granted they could be waiting for DeXter before including Delphi in their
ALM webpage. that is fine, but they could at least say something to the
Delphi community in an Open Letter to that effect.
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

Rick Carter writes:
Quote
But, as Brion recently pointed out, Borland's web pages show just one
development IDE tied to the ALM solution, and it ain't Delphi:
www.borland.com/us/products/core_sdp/
Recently? No, I pointed that out in February.
Even though David I has pushed it to the top of the blogs stack, it still
doesn't mention Delphi.
-Brion
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

"Brian Moelk" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
>- personally, I am delighted that BCB is rising from the (un)dead...

I think it is a good move, but there are better C++ strategies IMO.
Do you mean for Borland, or for developers?
BCB has been very good to us. You get most of the advantages of Delphi (RAD
design, 3rd party VCL-derived components, great addins like GExperts), with
the additional capability to directly compile and/or link a large choice of
libraries written in C or C++. [actually, I still feel most C++ libraries
are the work of the devil. Standard C libraries are painless by comparison ]
- Roddy
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

Lauchlan M wrote in <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>:
Quote
So I have to say, I don't see what your problem is. The Delphi IDE is
part of the ALM/SDO strategy.
That's not the impression I got from Boz's comments, where he clearly
seemed to be seperating the IDE from the ALM/SDO "strategy".
With that in mind, they appear to be doing ALM/SDO work /instead/ of
doing IDE work (as an example: Delphi/Win32's compiler being out of
sync with Delphi/.NET's compiler. Another example: No roadmap, plan or
seeming progress on a native 64-bit compiler).
Will
--
Want native support in Delphi for AMD64/EM64T? Vote here--
qc.borland.com/wc/qcmain.aspx
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

Quote
>I think it is a good move, but there are better C++ strategies IMO.

Do you mean for Borland, or for developers?
Both. But not necessarily the existing BCB crowd.
Quote
BCB has been very good to us. You get most of the advantages of Delphi
(RAD
design, 3rd party VCL-derived components, great addins like GExperts),
with
the additional capability to directly compile and/or link a large choice
of
libraries written in C or C++. [actually, I still feel most C++ libraries
are the work of the devil. Standard C libraries are painless by
comparison ]
Yes, that is the advantage of BCB, but as far as C++ developers go, I
believe that you are in the minority.
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

In particular,
Core::Developer says:
a.. Out-of-the-box support for all types of JavaT development, e.g.,
Enterprise JavaBeansT (EJBT), Web Services, XML, mobile, and database
application development.
a.. Supports all skill levels; wizards and tutorials reduce complexity,
while code control and accessibility is uncompromised.
a.. Distribute your development by modularizing your project for distributed
teams.
This makes it pretty certain that Delphi isn't considered a major player in
Borland's Core SDP strategy.
On third hand, as they probably say on some planet somewhere in the
multiverse, if .NET kills Java,
as MS intends, then Borland's Core SDP strategy will definitely have to
change if they don't want to go
down the Java tubes. Just what we need, a reason to cheer for Microsoft and
.NET. :-)
-- Larry Maturo
"Rick Carter" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
David Farrell-Garcia writes:
>Of course, ALM would not be ALM without the development IDE

But, as Brion recently pointed out, Borland's web pages show just one
development IDE tied to the ALM solution, and it ain't Delphi:
www.borland.com/us/products/core_sdp/

Rick Carter
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Chair, Delphi/Paradox SIG, Cincinnati PC Users Group

--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

"Larry Maturo" wrote
Quote

This makes it pretty certain that Delphi isn't considered
a major player in Borland's Core SDP strategy.
At least, as that strategy is /currently/ being sold. The question is
whether there's a corresponding .NET SDP in the works, but not on the
website yet because it simply isn't close enough to ready for them to taut
it yet.
bobD
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

Very true Bob. Only time will tell.
-- Larry
"Bob Dawson" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
"Larry Maturo" wrote
>
>This makes it pretty certain that Delphi isn't considered
>a major player in Borland's Core SDP strategy.

At least, as that strategy is /currently/ being sold. The question is
whether there's a corresponding .NET SDP in the works, but not on the
website yet because it simply isn't close enough to ready for them to taut
it yet.

bobD


 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

I'm not panicking at all, and I don't suspect the death of Delphi either. I
just said it was a badly worded article, and it could have been more more
clear instead of leaving people guessing.
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

From the article it is plain what Borland is concerned about:
"Visual Studio Team System"
And an IDE is only a part of that, but is a necessary part.
Borland is looking ahead to where MS is going and cannot afford to be
left behind.
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

"Angra Mainyu" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes:
Quote
www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1847835,00.asp

Borland has traditionally focused on three product lines-IDEs (integrated
development environments), run-times and ALM (application lifecycle management)
components-but Boz Elloy, senior vice president of software products at Borland,
said, "We're really focusing on the ALM portion. Stand-alone IDEs [are] not a
growing business for us."

The sad part is Borland is acting as its own worst enemy: It is
creating FOAD against itself.
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

Hi,
Quote
>
Ahhhhhhhh.
The Inprise b.s. starts again. Let's carve out Delphi from the Inprise
titanic...
This sound really like the Inprise story and a rebirth of some bad
managers ideas... and again the decline of borland.
With this views they really have to think to make delphi for example
"opensource"... if the CEO don't see any busines-future there... what
does they need a little "cash-cow" like delphi if the have sucht a big
ALM "Cash-dinosaur".
Nils Bödeker
PS: For example, the Interbase Open Source projekt is with "Firebird" a
really success... for the user...
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Re: Say it ain't so Boz

"Brian Moelk" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
Yep. Or they could keep us in the dark longer, which actually speaks
volumes.
I fully expect this is what they will do, given their track record.
 

Re: Say it ain't so Boz

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I fully expect this is what they will do, given their track record.
Yep. No RoadMap either, even though it was ready back in June.